Curse

I Phoenix I · Jul 09, 2008, 07:07 PM // 19:07

Would it be better to have them as Fire/Earth/Water or Fire/Earth/Air?

Basically...which would be more useful / used more often in PvE? Water or Air? I was planning to get decent weapon sets for my heroes, and I can't decide if the last hero should get Water or Air items + runes.

Thanks.

Master Necromanz · Jul 09, 2008, 07:09 PM // 19:09

I think/know that 3 ele cant be vanquish/do missions if you have f/e/w or whatever. I think you need a Renewal healer and a fire nuker also a blinding surge is fine and then if you are monk you should vanquish a lot or anything else....

I Phoenix I · Jul 09, 2008, 07:12 PM // 19:12

Er...I probably worded my question wrong...I'll edit OP.

Mortal Amongst Mere Gods · Jul 09, 2008, 07:18 PM // 19:18

I'd do F/E/A. Water has less dps than air in my experience, and as Necromanz said, BSurge is always good.

Keekles · Jul 09, 2008, 07:22 PM // 19:22

I usually run with just fire and air, with utility shared between them.

(Fire has Aegis, Air has Ward melee + epidemic) My last slot is usually gwen if I use that setup.

KMVRanger · Jul 09, 2008, 07:23 PM // 19:23

I use Vekk with Earth Fire Water (order doesn't matter). I am not at home so I can't post his exact build. Most of the spells I give him are low energy to cast and fairly quick to recharge (he tends to forget to use the Attunement elite

I gave him).

I do know he has WardAF and Steam as part of his build. I equipped him with Kerrsh's staff (Asuran NPC in...um...Tarnished Haven?) because it is a universal caster green. I also gave him eruption because most foes don't move out of the aoe before it blinds them. Especially usefull against rangers.

He does pretty well. Oh and I'm also would not put anything other than minor runes on him (keeps health up) or give him any touch skills (keeps him away from melee). Those tactics keep my Vekk alive most of the time.

Sun Fired Blank · Jul 09, 2008, 07:31 PM // 19:31

Water is okay. The problem is that quite a number of the options are focused on movement, and heroes don't properly use them. Also, none of the options adjust for the very significant armor bonuses in HM. The strongest of the line: Deep Freeze, Ice Spikes, Maelstrom, Blurred Vision. Frozen Burst and Steam are okay but a step under the aforementioned.

I Phoenix I · Jul 09, 2008, 07:32 PM // 19:32

So Air would most likely be better than Water when outfitting my third hero?

KMVRanger · Jul 09, 2008, 07:59 PM // 19:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sun Fired Blank

Deep Freeze, Ice Spikes, Maelstrom, Blurred Vision. Frozen Burst and Steam are okay but a step under the aforementioned.

I think blurred vision is the other skill in Vekk's build. But yah if you want a definite blind and better armor penatration go with air.

A little off the hero ele topic but I used an earthbind+whirlwind+aftershock spike (on my char not my hero) in the Grand Court mission. It all but killed the Unbound Energies in a single casting. (Off topic because a hero would never use the spike properly)

I Phoenix I · Jul 10, 2008, 12:15 AM // 00:15

Wait, so how would an Air Ele hero's bar look like?

digitalruse · Jul 10, 2008, 04:12 AM // 04:12

Quote:

Originally Posted by KMVRanger

I use Vekk with Earth Fire Water (order doesn't matter). I am not at home so I can't post his exact build. Most of the spells I give him are low energy to cast and fairly quick to recharge (he tends to forget to use the Attunement elite

I gave him).

I am intrigued by this build... tell me more...

-DR

cellardweller · Jul 10, 2008, 07:27 AM // 07:27

Water has 3 "power" skills - Maelstrom, Deep Freeze and Blurred Vision. The first 2 operate perfectly at 0spec and the last does just fine as at 9spec. I'd find it very hard to justify runing a hero up as a water ele.

Quote:

Originally Posted by I Phoenix I

Wait, so how would an Air Ele hero's bar look like?

It woudl be lovely if heroes could understand the glyph of swiftness/ether renewal combination but they'll spend half their time on 0 energy if you're not microing them. In the absence of that you're left with either [elemental attunement] or [blinding surge] - both have their uses.

I'll usually run something like the following:
[elemental attunement][air attunement][blinding flash][enervating charge][shell shock][epidemic][Fragility][accumulated pain]

distilledwill · Jul 10, 2008, 08:04 AM // 08:04

I always find earth to be very useful in Hard Mode.

This is a particularly useful one:

[build prof=E/N box EarthMagic=12+1+1 Storage=10+1 Curses=8][Unsteady Ground][Churning Earth][Glowstone][Enfeebling Blood][Ward Against Melee][Earth Attunement][Glyph Of Lesser Energy][Resurrection Signet][/build]

Although, if heroes can use [[Ash Blast] effectively with all those knockdowns I might consider slipping it in somewhere.

Edit: Just realised that this isnt hugely relavent! So in answer to your question; I guess Air if you have some nasty melee enemies to deal with. Otherwise I'd go for water and take [[Deep Freeze] and [[Maelstrom] to deal with any casters and to keep enemies in range of your earth/fire AoE.

Super Igor · Jul 10, 2008, 04:24 PM // 16:24

I lurve having [unsteady ground] ele with me and take it nearly all the time and much more often that fire, water or air, just because it provides so much defense to the party and is so effective.

joshuarodger · Jul 11, 2008, 12:02 AM // 00:02

Quote:

Originally Posted by cellardweller

Water has 3 "power" skills - Maelstrom, Deep Freeze and Blurred Vision. The first 2 operate perfectly at 0spec and the last does just fine as at 9spec. I'd find it very hard to justify runing a hero up as a water ele.

It woudl be lovely if heroes could understand the glyph of swiftness/ether renewal combination but they'll spend half their time on 0 energy if you're not microing them. In the absence of that you're left with either [elemental attunement] or [blinding surge] - both have their uses.

I'll usually run something like the following:
[elemental attunement][air attunement][blinding flash][enervating charge][shell shock][epidemic][Fragility][accumulated pain]

i see a couple problems with this bar but maybe i'm missing something.

first, why are you using dual attunement when you only have 3 elemental spells? none of which are very energy intensive. i think air attunement would do fine. if my SF ele can manage with just fire attunemnt so can this hero. then you could bring a better elite.
second, why do you have [[accumul] in this bar? you get deep wound if foe is suffering from 2 or more hexes. there's only one hex on that bar so you're completely negating the most effective part of that skill unless you bring another hero with more hexes, which is fine but should be noted.

@OP there are very few things in pve with more killing power than two eles both of which have [[searing flames] on their bar. if i were making a suggestion on which eles to take it would be two fire eles, not a mix of all three.

cellardweller · Jul 11, 2008, 01:37 AM // 01:37

Quote:

Originally Posted by joshuarodger

first, why are you using dual attunement when you only have 3 elemental spells? none of which are very energy intensive. i think air attunement would do fine. if my SF ele can manage with just fire attunemnt so can this hero. then you could bring a better elite.

hero+blindflash-dual attunemnt=no energy

SF Heroes run GolE and Glowing gaze - using two other slots for energy management would result in losing 2 conditions.

Quote:

Originally Posted by joshuarodger

second, why do you have [[accumul] in this bar? you get deep wound if foe is suffering from 2 or more hexes. there's only one hex on that bar so you're completely negating the most effective part of that skill unless you bring another hero with more hexes, which is fine but should be noted.

Yes, I'm assuming that a team of 7 characters will manage to have a single hex in there somewhere - it doesn't need to be stated because its patently obvious from the description of the skill.

Quote:

Originally Posted by joshuarodger

@OP there are very few things in pve with more killing power than two eles both of which have [[searing flames] on their bar. if i were making a suggestion on which eles to take it would be two fire eles, not a mix of all three.

This is true for easy mode, but for hard mode SF damage drops off significantly due to the astronomical armour levels. Keeping one fire ele for the SF/Rodgort's+ToF synergy is worthwhile, but not two.

bhavv · Jul 13, 2008, 12:27 AM // 00:27

3x Air ellys, 1x water elly.

You with Shell Shock / Invoke Lightning / Enervating charge / arc lightning / chain lightning / epidemic / attunement.

2 air heroes with invoke / chain lightning (on manual cast cos of exhaustion) / arc lightning / lightning touch / whirlwind / tenais wind / attunement / res.

1x water elly with blurred vision / ward against harm / ice spikes / glowing ice / Gole / heal party / attunement / res.

Go pwn some PVE ass.

Accursed · Jul 13, 2008, 02:30 AM // 02:30

I love having my custom fire build on my Zhed, and I'm looking forward to getting Vekk or Sousake for my defensive hybrid [water and earth magic] together. It would probably be great synergy along with a Necromancer healer, SS, or MM.

DarkSpirit · Jul 14, 2008, 01:48 AM // 01:48

This is what I bring as my Earth warder:

[build;OghkkwMYoIqDGbHCLeFnikLyIVA]

..sometimes I replace Ward against Elements with [[Ward of Stability].

KMVRanger · Jul 22, 2008, 05:09 PM // 17:09

Quote:

Originally Posted by digitalruse

I am intrigued by this build... tell me more...

-DR

Hey Sorry Digital

I hadn't checked back in to this thread in a while. One of my IGNs is Tahl Biko. Add to friends list. If you catch me online, I'll ping you the build.

I'll also make a note to check on it when I get home (at work now) and post the build back in this thread.

Man do I wish I could telecommute.